What the...?!: Kids lock disabled teen in burning woodshed

Four girls and a boy, all younger than 12. barred the door with a stick, and laughed and danced outside as the flames started to eat away the plywood structure. Brian, 14, who wears braces on his legs because of spina bifida, was trapped inside. A 39-year-old man eventually rescued him. (Toronto Globe & Mail)

Comments

[Sheila]

Absolutely vile "children." Someday they'll be in the headlines for even more vicious crimes. Amoral monsters.

[SwarthyTroll]

So the article says that most of these vermin are on welfare, which would seem to mean they don't have jobs. So why can't they keep their hellspawn under control?

[oxhead]

"How could children be so mean?"

Lady, mankind has been asking that question for thousands of years.

[Phranqlin]

Anyone else remember being tormented by other kids during their playground days? While nobody ever locked me in a burning shed like this poor boy, I had to deal with verbal abuse and violence from kids in my neighborhood because I didn't fit in. Children are not all bundles of sweetness and light. They can really be vicious because they haven't developed empathy: they are often unable to put themselves in another person's position or understand that what they do harms other people. It's the job of parents to instill this in kids and supervise them to make sure they behave properly. Our goal as parents is to raise our children to be decent human beings and not let them degenerate into savages straight out of "Lord of the Flies."

These kids need to face the consequences of their actions so they will understand the enormity of what they've done. Otherwise, they'll continue being a menace to society. And their parents need to be smacked around by the judicial system for not raising them right. Why on earth did they have kids in the first place if they didn't want to take care of them? I don't care how poor you are, there's no excuse for allowing your kids to run wild like this.

[mADMIKE]

This looks like the perfect thread to do some Canuck bashing. Who's first?

[Margot]

I remember this one time when my family were living on Venus, and the one freaking day of the year--the ONE day--that it quit raining and sun came out, all my douchebag classmates locked me in the freaking closet and then scarpered outside to play for the hour the sun was actually out, and then when it started raining again, and they came back in, they finally let me out, and acted like giving me flowers somehow made up for it, so I know how this kid feels. By the way, I got even with my classmates the next week when I brained them all with an axe.

[DP]

Does this answer the assertion that actually taking a 14 year old's threat to kill the president is far fetched?

Kids ape what they are exposed to.

[Jack]

Poor people should not have childern.

[Stan Flouride]

DP-
That 14 year old had Repuglicant parents- so yeah we know where she learned that violence is the answer.

[Bill]

When left to their own devices (unsupervised), children can be brutal! For some reason this incident reminds me of something out of Lord of the Flies!

[Bill]

If I would have read all the previous posts I would have seen someone else already made that connection!

[Phranqlin]

Margot, I was thinking almost the exact same thing. Ray Bradbury rules!

[chiarams]

"For some reason this incident reminds me of something out of Lord of the Flies!"

I think there's a significant difference between acting like a savage out of a need for survival, versus acting like a savage simply because you're simply an inhuman being.

[Rusty]

Ray Bradbury rules!

I too am a Ray Bradbury fan but he didn't write 'Lord of the Flies'. That was William Golding. (Just so you don't think I'm a complete ass, I did have to Google it.)
Is William Golding a pen name Ray Bradbury used?
And, oh yeah...if they ever remake 'Village of the Damned' or 'The Bad Seed' they can use these kids!

[Zcott]

This is the feel bad story of the day.

[Jeni]

So, let me get this straight: simply because I have little money, and am having to use financial assistance while i get my life together to take care of my children properly, I shouldn't have kids?

Because I have Republican leanings (no I DON'T think women should be able to have abortions whenever they feel like it) makes it doubly so?

Bad parenting happens across the board, regardless of financial security, regardless of political leanings. Quit looking for scapegoats, that's how we got in this mess to begin with.

Standard answer: We have over 6.5 billion people. This world would be a better place without those four miniature shitheads.

[Soo]

I agree with Jeni.

Shitheads will be shitheads, no matter what financial or political background they're in. If you think long enough, you'll be able to recall at least one interaction with a jackass kid from money you wanted to slap into oblivion.

However! When my parents split, my mom had to take a second job to make ends meet. She wasn't always home, and we had to police ourselves, so to speak. One of six went "south," but she was already headed in that direction. The rest of us stayed out of jail, none of us locked anyone into a burning shed or video'd burning turtles just for fun.

Sometimes it's just bad parenting, and sometimes kids are just pure evil.

[K]

Rusty, while Lord of the Flies was not written by Ray Bradbury, the story that Margot is referring to was. I can't remember the name of it, but it is a perfect example of how cruel children can be. Margot - what is the name of the story?

[K]

Aha! All Summer in a Day

[dave W]

To Paraphrase The song title " [email protected] Canada"

[bg]

All this Republican bashing...don't you all realize that we're in a one-party system now, where there's no real difference between Democraps and Republicants?

[WZ]

I don't think the basic issue is the social assistance, but that so many end up on social assistance because of drug and alcohol abuse. Drug and alcohol abuse are specifically mentioned in the article. If you're only going to neglect your children and allow them to run around in these viscious groups so you can get wasted then no, you shouldn't be having kids at all.
Again, the issue isn't welfare, it's neglectful parenting. The need for welfare in that case is a symptom, not a cause.

[Ambs]

chiarams, have you actually read Lord of the Flies? The kids don't turn into little monsters "out of a need for survival." They can survive just fine on the island without turning savage -- there are plenty of resources for all of them, without having to exclude anybody. But they just happen to decide to play this little game that involves most of them hunting down two of them.

As soon as I read this story I thought about that book. I wonder how long it will be before the legal age for prosecution is dropped down to 8 or so. If pre-adolescents keep doing things like this, probably not long.

[RainMaker]

Interesting thread. As a parent, I'm supposed to teach my children empathy, to understand how the other fellow feels. OK, I'm all for it. What do you tell the boy who got locked in a shed and set afire? How do you teach him to protect himself against these evil children, who will one day be evil adults? Schools and the government claim to have "zero tolerance" against bullies, but this story points out the reality -- the perpetrators are already treated as victims, there are no real consequences for what they did and the poor kid will get beat up again for not dying in the shed.

[Swangirl]

Zcot, you beat me to it! I have to wonder. If this poor child had ended up dying, would they have done ANYTHING to these brats?

"Sometimes it's just bad parenting, and sometimes kids are just pure evil."

Well said, Soo. It would be a lot easier if it were so easy to pigeonhole but it isn't. Bad behavior knows no socio-economic boundaries.

I was never locked in a burning woodshed but I did have a bad childhood experience with three little girls who lived across the street from me. They pretended to like me but it turned out they were having a grand old time making fun of me behind my back. All with their parents' full knowledge. It wasn't violent but I still feel awful remembering it.

I can only imagine how much worse this boy is going to feel in years to come.

[Howie Feltersnatch]

Jeni,

How about you accept that women should be allowed to have abortions if they wish, and I'll accept that poor people should be allowed to have kids?

[yo]

Just a note- the name of the paper is "The Globe and Mail," not "Toronto Globe and Mail." You wouldn't cite the "New York Village Voice," would you?

[Charles]

"Police describe the run-down public housing complex as a high-crime area. Mr. Bird and others who live here say gangs of children roam the neighbourhood unsupervised in the evenings. The 12-year-olds encourage the younger ones to fight each other for entertainment, Mr. Bird said. Children as young as 7 or 8 can be seen smoking and drinking beer in the evening, he added. Arson is a regular occurrence."

And here I though Toronto was supposed to be nice. 7 year olds drinking beer? This might possibly be a case of actual bad kids from bad homes, but since the writer didn't use those words, it doesn't officially count.

[ttq]

While locking the kids in a burning shed so they know what it feels like is not an acceptable punishment. Locking them in jail for a very long time would suffice.

[MM]

This did not happen in Toronto - it happened in Winnipeg, Manitoba. but that's besides the point.
Yes, this incident happened in a poor housing community - where 95% of the residents are native american.
Yes, most of them are on welfare.
The more kids you have, more money is given out. especially if you're native.
Instead of spending money on the kids, they would rather buy drugs or alcohol or listerine.
These kids have no supervision at all, and are often seen drinking booze and smoking. these are 12 yr old kids!!
The sad thing is, nothing can be done about them. They will not get punishment for their actions.
It's the same thing here in saskatchewan, all these bored kids are stealing cars, setting fires and there is nothing the police can do but say, "now don't do that again!" but the next night, they are out doing the same thing.

[WZ]

I'm not sure what the race of the children has to do with anything, especially when the disabled kid is also apparently Native.
I'm not sure how welfare works in Canada, it doesn't work like that in the US. I don't know anyone who gets more welfare for being Native, that's not how it works here; and you don't get more welfare for more kids here either.

[Jim]

Notice also what's NOT in the story ... any mention of Brian's parents. It says he had just come to live in the complex with his grandma, then changes the subject before anything can be said about his mother and father. You can be pretty sure that this is happening because they don't have their s**t together enough to raise their kid(s). And you can also be pretty sure the bioparents don't contribute any financial support either or he would be living somewhere better. Everyone can jump on the parents of the kids who locked him in there and how ill-behaved the kids are, but the other half of parenting is that the world will always be full of bad people who were raised by decent parents and part of parenting is protecting your kids from them till they can fend for themselves.

[Love1]

I'm afraid your wrong Jim I have a drug addicted sister, who I've tryed to help. But reguardless she keeps having kids because yes the US government gives you more money for more kids!

[Love1]

Sorry it was WZ who made was talking about the US not giving more money for more children!

[Love1]

It is children like these whose parants drink and do drugs that the government likes to protect and support. I'm a single mother and I workk hard but there is no relief is sight, but if I were to stop working and become a leech the US tax payer would pick up the bill for feeding me, giving a better house minus good neibors and give me a check per child I decided to have. But since I do an honest days work, there is not a penny to spare. These kids are protected because their under age, but whose going to protect the boy whose been locked in the shed. And if the police know these things are going on where are they while it's going on.

[Lee]

Next time someone smugly asserts that we should "Imagine" a better world that could exist without Christianity, or sneers at the 1950s "Ward & June Cleaver" family values as outdated, remember these five kids.

The next time you hear a liberal piously assert that human beings are basically good, but existing institutions such as the Church teach them to be wicked, remember these five kids.

This is the future, boys and girls. The report card on the child-rearing skills of welfare dependents and social workers is in, and it is all Fs. Christianity and family values have been read the riot act. Fathers are no longer needed in a household, and mothers are in fact economically encouraged to be rid of them, while fathers are absolved of any responsibility. We tolerate sex outside of wedlock, and no one is there to raise children, but only to grow them.

Are we happy with the handiwork of liberalism yet?

Lee,
Pull your head out of your ass.

[MM]

oh please, don't blame liberalism for bad kids, or bad parenting.
christianity isn't a save all solution, the way i see it (and i'm not the only one) is that organized religion, especially christianity (the most corrupt religion) is what's wrong with the world today.
organized religion causes more wars and problems than liberalism and bad parenting combined!

[d_m_arnold]

Ghandi once said, "I like Christ but I don't care for Christians. Most I've met aren't very much like Christ."

If you want to see true Christianity in action, take a look at that Amish community in PA. Someone does unspeakable evil to them and they respond with forgiveness, love and support. How many others, Christian or otherwise, would do the same?

[WZ]

Love, that depends on the state. In Minnesota you can get medical care for each of your kids, and you can get food stamps for the kids - you cannot get more money if you have more kids, and you can only get money for 6 months anyway.

[Bojack]

I'll bet these little bastards were on the way to church(a christian one, the worst kind.)When they tried to torch Brian. MM you are truly a dipshit.

[flatdaddy]

Anyone who's surprised that children can act this way towards the weak and vulnerable apparently has forgotten most of their own childhood. Children are the worst sort of people on earth- self-absorbed, inconsiderate, intolerant, conformist sadists. No one is born with empathy and consideration for others, it has to be instilled into us (if it ever really is) either through example or fear of the consequences of our actions.

[DP]

How about you accept that women should be allowed to have abortions if they wish, and I'll accept that poor people should be allowed to have kids?

Howie,

Which poor person came to your door asking for permission to have kids??

People are gonna have kids whether you like it or not!

You dont have to accept anything

[DP]

Ghandi once said, "I like Christ but I don't care for Christians. Most I've met aren't very much like Christ."

arnold:
A continuation of this quote refers to eating beef and drinking beer. The major porblem that Gandhi had with Christians (as would most Indians) was to do with eating the holy cow - so to speak. The only other problem he had with then was the British ruling India.

[DP]

Howie,

The same goes for women who want to abort thier babies.
As of today, they still can abort thier babies if they want to(provided they are in the earlier stages of thier pregnancy), regardless of whether jeni accepts it or not.

Sorry, didnt mean to single you acceptance of the poor people's right to pro-create!

[DP]

Lee,

I dont think organized church, as it is today, is the solution to everything.

I do agree with you, though that a major part of the problem with kids today is absentee-parents, broken families and addictions, that leave kids hardened and emotionally bankrupt. I guess the solution to the situation lies in the hands of each individual adult. When one adult screws up it affects every child he/she is responsible for. And then it has a cascading effect on generations to come.

I think a greater part of the solution is recognition of the problem, the conviction of each adult to put his/her best foot forward for thier child and commitment towards that goal by each person.

Children need stable homes and able parents (not ones doped to dreamland) for wholsome growth. Everyone of us can and must change the world for the little ones under our care, by striving to provide them with it. It is the kids' right.

If we do that we would soon get to a point where we dont have incidents of this kind.