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No jeans!: University implements dress code for business students
I thought I was tough when I forced a seating chart on my college students at UW-Milwaukee, but telling the kids to dress up for class!? Illinois State University College of Business students have been told to don business casual attire in class -- or risk getting kicked out for the day. (Inside Higher Ed)
August 22, 2007 | Permalink
Comments
Hmm....seems like the backlash against people dressing like sh*t is trickling down to the colleges now. More and more companies are enforcing stricter dress codes nowadays, and it's all attributed to people who don't know how to dress properly. Usually by women who think it's OK to have bare midriff with an ultra tight shirt and their thong underwear sticking above their pant waist. This is just simply not acceptable in the business world (no matter what type of business). So, yeah, go ISU for working to turnout respectable members of society.
Posted by: echelon | Aug 22, 2007 5:24:08 AM
Part of College is being prepared for the "real world"... I'll all for this!
Posted by: Jack | Aug 22, 2007 5:29:55 AM
As long as you are not meeting with clients and you do a good job I don't really see what the big deal is. A comfortable employee is a happy employee, and a happy employee is a productive employee. La de da.
We just had a "polite reminder" go out last week that jeans were for Fridays only. Which meant I had to spend Saturday pant shopping. Grrrr.
Posted by: elchampino | Aug 22, 2007 6:14:45 AM
That's a bunch of BS. As a college student (at least in a real college - not Partytown U.) you have enough crap to deal with. When I was in school there were many times I didn't go home. I went straight to the library or computer cluster to work all night. I'd at least like to be comfortable while working on some asshole professor's sadistic assignment where I have to drink 10 Jolt colas just to stay awake.
College is not that business world. And anybody with any brain in their head will figure out once they leave college and go into the business world that they need to dress appropriately.
Posted by: G-Man | Aug 22, 2007 6:19:24 AM
Ah the repressed people of fly-over country still believe that forcing someone to dress in a certain way makes a damn bit of difference in how they act.
College is supposed to educate you, not teach you fashion (unless you take a class on fashion). Are we turning our future business people into a bunch of fashion-obsessed dandies and fops?
Posted by: Sean, Torrington CT | Aug 22, 2007 6:27:01 AM
I've been in the "real world" of work for over ten years now. I've never worked at a place that required you to dress "business casual." If your employees' work abilites are proportional to how well they dress, then you're hiring the wrong people or more likely you have a poorly managed work environment.
When you have face time with clients/customers/vendors, then it certainly makes sense to dress well, since that's a sign of respect to them.
Yes, many times I would see a female co-worker in a rather tight shirt and go "wow" - and then I'd go straight back to work.
From my own personal, male perspective it's idiocy to think that an attractive woman dressed skimpy becomes any less attractive when she's well dressed in a business suit. If someone (male or female) is trying to make themselves look good, they're going to look good.
Control your hormones. If you like to be well dressed, then be well dressed. Personally, I dress in short sleeve button shirts and either slacks or new-looking jeans.
Posted by: acp | Aug 22, 2007 6:35:56 AM
My sister attended a "business" college back in '91 which had a strict "skirts only" policy for females and even dictated the styles of dress shoe for males. The competition to get into this school was unbelievable, so I imagine that those who wish to succeed didn't care what the code was.
I would expect to see such a dress code adjustment create a fuss at Clown College, not a business school.
Posted by: Soo | Aug 22, 2007 6:38:58 AM
Business shouldn't even be taught in colleges. The study of "business" should be a tech school thing. Colleges and universities are meant for well rounded liberal arts education and the hard sciences, engineering included.
Posted by: vksjk | Aug 22, 2007 6:53:42 AM
My wife had a professor last year that required her students to come to class in appropriate teacher attire. She was an early childhood education major. If I am not mistaken she even had 10 points deducted because she wore a tank top. It was summer in Savannah, Ga, so the temp was about 95. There was a no shorts, no tank tops, no mini skirts or revealing clothing policy. I am on the fence with it though. I have seen college age students come to an interview in shorts and flip flops, so it may be a necessary evil.
Posted by: micedwhale | Aug 22, 2007 6:54:02 AM
Look if you are waltzing into an interview with shorts and flip flops you are an idiot. Considering that instant screening, you don't want that person working for you anyway.
Posted by: elchampino | Aug 22, 2007 6:59:04 AM
On the other side of the coin, I know a Ph.D. (not business prof) who teaches his classes, dirty and stinking, stating that he wants his students to know how inferior to him they are. The students complain to his superiors because the guy stinks on a regular basis, but so far, their complaints have been ignored. He is the laughing stock of his campus, for several reasons including the foul odor. The main lesson his students learn is that a Ph.D. is no guarantee of intelligence.
Posted by: Sheila | Aug 22, 2007 7:16:19 AM
I had a philosophy professor who wore the exact same black jeans and black tshirt to every single class. Also a trench coat (not black, brown). When it was cold he would wear a black sweat shirt. With holes in it.
Posted by: elchampino | Aug 22, 2007 7:19:11 AM
My goodness people. The school is only asking that students wear chinos and collared shirts. They aren't asking for two or three piece designer suits and high heels.
I'm in the business world and am constantly surprised at how excited people get over additional "jeans days."
I feel as comfortable in khakis and a shirt as I do in jeans and a T-shirt.
I also don't get the complaints about how much extra money people have to spend. Sure you can go out and buy a suit that would do the CEO of Dow proud or designer clothes if you have the money, but my understanding is that $15 chinos and $10 Oxford shirt from Walmart would be in compliance.
Posted by: Kghoti | Aug 22, 2007 7:26:08 AM
That's a bunch of BS. As a college student (at least in a real college - not Partytown U.) you have enough crap to deal with.
----
Man, that's the dumbest thing I heard all day. I had more free time in undergrad and grad than every before in my life. Here's something to chew on: prior to a product launch at a convention, we worked 14 days straight, 11-13 hour days to finish software, some guys slept at work, then we flew to Orlando and worked on the presentation slides for 24 hours straight, gave the presentation, flew back Tuesday and had to show up for a client meeting on Wednesday morning. While in grad school I had a 9-5 job and only did like 3 hours of classes after and you know, got to read and write in my house.
Posted by: DCer | Aug 22, 2007 7:30:41 AM
Sean...I completely agree with you.
I've worked in the professional arena for quite a while. There is a time to dress professionally and if you dont know when it is...then you wont be successful...period.
I found when I was doing outside sales in a more rural area that if I dressed very professionally people ran in the opposite direction, so I went to business casual and was very successful. However, working in the corp environment in the city, professional was the only way you'd be viewed respectfully. While you're in college its about being comfortable and learning, not being all suited up.
Posted by: cherie | Aug 22, 2007 7:32:37 AM
I work for the gubermint in jeans (sometimes dockers) and a button up shirt. Lots of guys were comment T Shirts. I think it looks really unprofessional, but who am I to complain if the management weenies say you can wear sandals.
Posted by: Zwxphtt | Aug 22, 2007 7:45:03 AM
I've worked for firms whose dress codes were all over the map. Most were either business casual or completely casual. However, one company insisted on formal business attire for everyone: dress shirts, ties, slacks and jackets or suits for men; skirts, dresses, or suits for women. At the other extreme, another company's entire dress code was "Employees shall wear footwear when going into the building." A couple of old hippie programmers were in the habit of arriving at work barefoot, which ticked off building management and prompted the rule. Most of my co-workers there dressed in the unofficial uniform of the computer industry (jeans, computer t-shirt, and sneakers).
About the only dress code I ever encountered in college was an elderly professor who requested that students not wear hats in class, except for religious reasons. (He also made an exception for a kid who was undergoing chemo and had lost all his hair.) In labs, we had to wear long pants or jeans and closed-toed shoes, but that was more of a safety issue.
Business casual is not a hard or horribly expensive dress code to follow -- although I think telling female students not to wear patterned clothing is kind of bizarre. I guess the school wants to make wearing appropriate clothing something that's automatic in their students. It seems gratuitous, though.
Posted by: Phranqlin | Aug 22, 2007 7:50:01 AM
Business casual is a feminist plot! Jackets and ties convey masculine power. That's why I wear them every day, even on "casual Fridays."
Posted by: Oxhead | Aug 22, 2007 7:52:47 AM
"Man, that's the dumbest thing I heard all day. I had more free time in undergrad and grad than every before in my life. Here's something to chew on: prior to a product launch at a convention, we worked 14 days straight, 11-13 hour days to finish software, some guys slept at work, then we flew to Orlando and worked on the presentation slides for 24 hours straight, gave the presentation, flew back Tuesday and had to show up for a client meeting on Wednesday morning. While in grad school I had a 9-5 job and only did like 3 hours of classes after and you know, got to read and write in my house."
Well DCer, I have no idea what school you went to, but I bet if you were at my university you wouldn't have had all that free time (especially if you were a Computer Science major). And if you are working all night in your job as a programmer, big deal. Every programmer works those kind of hours, especially before a product release.
Posted by: | Aug 22, 2007 8:15:43 AM
That's my post above.
Posted by: G-Man | Aug 22, 2007 8:16:08 AM
Just another example of screwed-up priorites and the usual ivory-tower cluelessness about the real-world. I consult to many software firms and I've never been to a meeting yet where anyone wore "business attire." Last meeting I went to was led by a pony-tailed guy in blue jeans.
Posted by: | Aug 22, 2007 8:36:52 AM
It's all about appearances, people.
Dress codes do indeed run the gamut, but I can't see where this is harmful to young people. It doesn't hurt them to learn how to dress like a grown-up or how to properly present themselves during a formal interview.
On a tangent-the first formal interview I ever went to was for a legal secretary position for a lawyer that worked out of his home. I was dressed to the nines...suit, pumps, hose, the works. The woman who did the interview was the office manager and was also the lawyer's wife. She had three kids and they ran around during the interview screaming their heads off. I did alright until she started breastfeeding the 3-year old DURING THE INTERVIEW.
I turned the job down when they offered it to me.
Posted by: pnwgal | Aug 22, 2007 8:39:11 AM
I work in an office building, but we're not customer facing employees, I deal with them on the phone sometimes. I wear jeans and a t-shirt every day. One day i wore shorts and flip flops but that seemed totally wrong to me.
Posted by: boynamedsue | Aug 22, 2007 8:41:46 AM
This is the same stink that people make over uniforms for younger children in school. Somehow, I don't think that pants are somehow made more appropriate when the material is switched from denim to khaki. I think that clothing with text on it (t-shirts, usually) can be more distracting. Often, the messages are put on them with the intent to disrupt.
More interesting is the head covering rules. No hats unless its a religious symbol or cultural tradition. So, is wearing a caterpillar ball cap a redneck cultural tradition?
Posted by: Sigh | Aug 22, 2007 8:57:47 AM
DCer, you're doing it wrong! You bust ass in school so you don't have to at work. Sounds like you need better project management.
When I went interviewing in 1997, I immediately discarded any jobs that require you to wear a suit and/or tie. Sure, you could get paid more working in such a place, but it wasn't worth it in terms of comfort and additional clothing budget.
Posted by: Sean, Torrington CT | Aug 22, 2007 8:58:28 AM
